In this exclusive interview, we delve into the journey of MICHAEL NORDSTRAND, a perfumer with an impressive educational background. He opens up about his journey into perfumery and his path to founding his atelier, MYTHOLOGIST STUDIO. Michael provides insights into the challenges of training and the creative process. He addresses the debate between natural and synthetic ingredients, emphasizing the importance of education and responsible marketing. Additionally, Michael shares his vision for the future of perfumery in terms of techniques and technology.
So, Michael, could we start with a recap of your personal background and journey until you became interested in fragrances? You studied at the most renowned perfumery schools in the world, such as Givaudan, ISIPCA, and GIP. What drove you to explore the realm of perfumery in a more technical way?
I started simply, and humbly, with an aromatherapy class to reduce my stress level. I was working as an artistic director and needed to do something that was completely unrelated to my day job. From that point on, the stage was sort of set. I’m already a voracious reader but I set about getting my hands on every perfumery book I could and then putting what I learned into practise. Those first few years of intense self-training laid the groundwork for the opportunities I had later on.
What were the biggest challenges in your training? In retrospect, is there anything you wish you had known beforehand or would have done differently? What would you say to someone who aspires to become a perfumer?
I think one of the biggest challenges during my training was having an idea in mind and sometimes failing to execute that with a formula trial. Occasionally, instead of learning from the errors I made, I felt lost and frustrated. I hear variations of this very often from people learning perfumery, so my advice to them is take chances, and be willing to fail. Instead of frustration, harness your curiosity to investigate why something you created didn’t meet your expectations. Failure is more instructive than any success, in my experience.
You consider yourself a ‘method perfumer’. What does that mean? Could you share with us your creation process, from how your clients discover you to the completion of the fragrance? Who is your typical client?
For me I live-breathe-dream-embody the brief of the fragrance I’m working on to best understand it and feel it as authentically as possible. The output I generate then is laser focused and it becomes more natural to iterate on concepts and explore new materials & methodologies. It doesn’t mean every brief is a breeze, nor does it mean that a so-called ‘method perfumer’ is the best kind. It’s just my kind.
Please describe how you built your lab and what your routine is in it. How many raw materials, whether natural or synthetic, do you work with? Is there an ingredient you couldn’t live without? Do you have a signature?
Originally my ‘labs’ were in my apartments in Brooklyn, or Manhattan; when I moved to New Jersey I built out a home lab and office space but eventually outgrew it. Today I work with my team at a loft space about 20 minutes outside the city. The number of raw materials in the studio is 1,500 to 2,000 easily, but on a regular basis we probably use 300-450 of those most often, with others only making occasional appearances when the brief is right or the mood strikes. I work in mixed media so it’s a combination of synthetic, hemi-synthetic and natural.
My ‘signature’ has been described as balanced, thoughtful, with a lot of nuances; I do build formulas with specific intentions and am often instructing students and apprentice perfumers to be thoughtful in their approach and to have a rationale behind each component while never losing the wabi-sabi sort of impulse to do something that seems crazy.
Perfume creation really for me is world building; when it’s thought of simply as this accord or that combination it can quickly read as flat or simplistic—even academic. I think I’m most interested in olfactory tromp l’oeil (tromp le nez?): I want you to smell an apple and so I build you an orchard, or a dutch master painting, or a vertical farm in a dystopian future, and then I produce the apple note. And you (I hope) have a more intense or immediate response because I led you there with an olfactory cue.
A few clients have called my work somber, meditative, evocative. I don’t think those are indicative of my overall style but I guess in every case beauty (or somberness) is in the nose of the beholder, no?
As for a material I couldn’t live without, right now I would say any sort of incense extract, or perhaps tuberose absolute; if we are talking the more quotidian materials, natural ambroxide is a favourite as well as natural ambrettolide. Of course your mentioning this makes me want to do the exercise of going without these things to see how formulas would come together in their total absence.
Which ingredient or accord do you find the most difficult to handle? What is the most unusual accord you have ever created? And which one did you create that had an unexpected result?
I’ve spent the better part of the last year-and-a-half acting as the new in-house perfumer for a niche brand, and one of the briefs—the first, actually—that I was tasked with proved to be a major challenge for me, as the hero material they selected tends to be unwieldy—extremely hard to tame in every sense—and its scent is not usually the subject of adulation. I had to completely rethink my formulation techniques and go far outside even my wilder imaginings to achieve my goals, but I am really proud of the result. I actually just popped the latest round of sampling into the post, so we’ll see what they have to say! This particular fragrance should launch early next year.
Do you wear any fragrances yourself? Could you share with us some of your favorites, whether personally or technically? Are there any perfumers who have inspired you or whose work you particularly admire?
I do wear fragrances when I can—when I am not testing mods for projects—but I don’t tend to consistently wear one perfume over another.
I will say that Dominique Ropion is a perfumer I admired early on, and even as my knowledge and experience have expanded he remains a shining example for me. To that I would probably add Olivia Giacobetti, who is such an innovator in her own right; and numerous independent and entirely self-taught perfumers like John Biebel, who I am privileged to call a friend as well as a colleague. The last few purchases I made when I was in Paris were signed by Nicolas Beaulieu, and I think his sensibility and style of formulation speak to me on a deep level; I am incredibly impressed with him.
And because it’s likely nobody has mentioned this man before in an interview, or as an inspiration, I would like to put forward Jean Grèget, who worked for Firmenich and was the author of the original fragrance by Fendi (not this new colour line they’ve released, but the one from 1985). Fendi was one of the first popular perfumes to use Polysantol and Exaltolide, which the company debuted that year and are now ubiquitous; and it is a bombastic chypre like no other. It’s a shame every database lists ‘Firmenich’ as the perfume’s author now, as many extant fragrances still in production owe something of their DNA to this fragrance, I think.
Natural versus synthetic and IFRA/EU restrictions are recurring and controversial debate topics, not to mention the continuous spread of misinformation. Could you offer us a brief overall view on these subjects?
Everyone in the sphere of perfumery—perfumers and perfume companies, regulatory and government bodies, brand founders and educators, even fragrance enthusiasts and consumers—has a responsibility to educate themselves and others whenever possible.
I understand for the average consumer that sometimes it is difficult to separate the wheat from the chaff, and this is where the large companies with a lot of resources should be doing far more to pass knowledge to the general public.
Brands, too—whether their products are natural or mixed media—should avoid fear-based or misleading marketing and instead focus on what their unique selling point is.
I see far too many brands attempting to capitalise on consumer fear and lack of knowledge to make money, and it’s low-hanging fruit. Something to look out for are blanket statements of any kind regarding the safety of what goes into a bottle of perfume. The reality is that our industry is quite heavily regulated and follows scientific evidence and fact rather than fear.
People are increasingly interested in understanding their fragrances. Experts consider knowledge one of the key elements of new luxury. What would you recommend to those who want to learn more about perfumery?
If someone wants to better understand fragrance I would suggest they read about it, or have a conversation with someone who works professionally in the space. A good entry point could be anything from the books and periodicals by the fantastic team at Nez la Revue to inspirational works by authors like Dominique Roques, Diane Ackerman, or Mandy Aftel, which offer insight into both the history and present-day practise of perfumery as well as a celebration of our sense of smell. There are also numerous publications by perfumers (in their own words) that are informative and encouraging for anyone studying the craft.
What trends do you foresee in the coming years in terms of themes, consumer behavior, and the perfume market in general? What about new methods and techniques? What are the main challenges for perfumers today?
Regulation is and will remain a challenge to perfumery as an industry, and innovation will almost always be the answer; it’s a predator/prey arms race in every sense.
Our palette contracts and expands on a regular basis, and with the technologies available to the industry the possibilities are fascinating. I am particularly impressed with companies like Ultra International, Payan Betrand, Capua, and Biolandes, who are pioneering novel extractions and techniques that will shape the perfumery of tomorrow.
I also think we will continue to see larger companies attempt to leverage technology in every application; whether it is really serving them (or us) in every situation is another question, however.
A great example of this is the new(ish) Prada Paradoxe, which is augmented with AI* and feels, olfactively, like a race to the middle. It has thousands upon thousands of formulas as its reference point, so it smells simultaneously of everything and nothing; reviews of it unwittingly confirm this when a consumer says ‘it smells like walking into a perfume store’.
It is a subjectively nice smell more than it is a finished perfume, one which has three credited authors as well as Givaudan’s AI platform Carto (which isn’t credited as an author). I haven’t dared to look but I will venture a guess it’s won a mainstream award or two, but for me it commits the direst sin of perfumery: the smell of it is unmemorable.
*From the Prada website: This unique fresh and floral signature is augmented by Artificial Intelligence that enables perfumers to explore new possibilities and express their creativity, and compose new and unexpected accords with a jasmine accord.*
*About Carto: https://www.givaudan.com/fragrance-beauty/perfumery-school/carto-the-future-of-fragrance-formulations*
Video Credits: Givaudan
In 2 or 3 words, how would you define perfume?
Perfume is art.
Michael, thank you for your time and for sharing valuable insights with us. Would you like to add something before we wrap up?
Thank you so much Daniel for your time in preparing the interview and for allowing me to share my point of view on so many topics. For anyone reading, I am always happy to connect via Instagram or via my studio website. Thanks for reading!
Follow Michael on Instagram: @michaelnordstrandperfumer
Check out Mythologist’s website: http://www.mythologiststudio.com
Leave a comment for Michael below!
(image credits: Michael Nordstrand, except for the perfumers’ images)
